Posts by Disillusioned JW

5

New Game: Spot Those Logic Fallacies! - "theory of evolution is 'much further from being proved than men are from flying to the moon.'"

by cognisonance in

i read on here someone paraphrasing from evolution versus the new world the quote in this post's title where a scientist is quoted as saying the theory of evolution is "much further from being proved than men are from flying to the moon.

for those interested in the quoted scientist actual words, you can read them at google books.

of course the author, a chemist, is refering to the theory of evolution by natural selection, something he refers to as "percise theory," as opposed to "vague thoery," the latter he is describing the easy-to-see evidence that evolution has happened.

Disillusioned JW

McRoberts , in the Introduction to his book called God: Can the God of the Bible Exist?, says the following.

'Today, it appears to me that God has been used by those in authority to "trick us into being good" in much the same way as Santa is used by parents on their children. What has been particularly frightening about this is how those wielding this authority throughout history have defined "good". Often their definitions have been worse than the natural behavior of the majority of the individuals they have controlled.

Beliefs ingrained in us from childhood which are carried into adulthood are seldom questioned. They seem to become almost a part of our personality. It is a bold endeavor to examine such beliefs and agree to open-mindedly attend to the arguments of a non-believer. The fact that you are reading this book indicates that you have a courageous heart searching for the truth, whatever it may be. For that, I commend you, and thank you in advance for hearing me out rather than dismissing such thoughts out of hand.'

By the way, it is at https://www.smmcroberts.net/religion/fundamentalism/watchtower/fit/chap14.html that McRoberts' book about the problems of the JW religion quotes the WT's booklet called "Evolution Versus the New World" quoting Standen (though the fictional character in McRoberts' book somewhat misrepresents the quote of the Standen, by referring to evolution rather than by referring specifically to what Standen calls "the precise theory of evolution".)

5

New Game: Spot Those Logic Fallacies! - "theory of evolution is 'much further from being proved than men are from flying to the moon.'"

by cognisonance in

i read on here someone paraphrasing from evolution versus the new world the quote in this post's title where a scientist is quoted as saying the theory of evolution is "much further from being proved than men are from flying to the moon.

for those interested in the quoted scientist actual words, you can read them at google books.

of course the author, a chemist, is refering to the theory of evolution by natural selection, something he refers to as "percise theory," as opposed to "vague thoery," the latter he is describing the easy-to-see evidence that evolution has happened.

Disillusioned JW

The statement of "... a quote used in 1967 ..." has me wondering what source published the quote in 1967. The WT booklet called "Evolution Versus The New World" is copyright 1950, not in 1967, though perhaps it was last printed in 1967. As a result the statement of "... and of course men flew to the moon 2 years after this booklet was pubished by the WBTS" is very puzzling to me. The WT book called Did Man Get Here By Evolution Or By Creation? is copyright 1967 but it doesn't seem to have a quote of Anthony Standen. Anthony Standen's comment is in a book of his which is copyright 1950.

Back in 1950 little had been accomplished in obtaining the ability of sending humans to the moon, thus it is understandable that Standen made the comment regarding men flying to the moon. Though Standen was a chemist according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony_Standen he was also an entomologist (a scientist who studies insects and thus also a life scientist). https://www.nytimes.com/1993/06/25/obituaries/anthony-standen-is-dead-at-86-chemist-who-deflated-pomposity.html says "He also held an advanced degree in entomology, the branch of zoology that deals with insects, from the University of New Hampshire.'

I agree that the WT booklet called "Evolution Versus The New World" uses faulty logic many times and that it is often distorts the ideas of the evolution and what proponents (including scientists) of evolution consider to be evidence for evolution.

As a result of looking for a quote by the WT of Standen I discovered https://www.smmcroberts.net/ by Steve McRoberts. McRoberts in his book called Falling In Truth: The Education of a Jehovah’s Witness (which can be read online for free) identifies himself as a former JW who served at Bethel (apparently for no more than two years, probably no more than about one year) "... became disillusioned, and left ..." and since then "... never set foot in a Kingdom Hall of Jehovah’s Witnesses ..." again. In that book (written in the form of a fictional story) he prevents many great arguments against the WT religion, including a number of scientific points (including claims backing evolution). The book does have some incorrect (or partially incorrect) ideas, but overall it is very informative.

Another one of McRoberts' book is called The Cure for Fundamentalism: Why the Bible Cannot be the Word of God (Also known as: Can the Bible be God's Word?), which is a commentary on parts of the Bible. It makes a number of good arguments, but it also has erroneous ideas. The book can be read online for free. In the introduction of that book the author says the following.

'I was raised a Catholic, attended Catholic school, converted to being a Jehovah's Witness, and finally disassociated from organized religion entirely. If the Bible is God's word, it should speak to the common man in easily understandable language. We should not have to rely on theologians who may tell us what they want us to believe.

In what follows, I have read through the Bible from cover to cover and given my thoughts wherever I felt it appropriate to do so. I have usually given the entire quote rather than just the reference, so that it is not necessary for the reader to have a Bible in hand while reading.

... What gives me the right to criticize the Word of God? Well, that begs the question. We must first examine the Bible to determine whether it lives up to this claim. After all, unless you have been privy to some direct vision from God, it has just been human beings that have told you that the Bible is the Word of God. Human beings have been known to be wrong in the past. You can't believe everything they say. You must at least give ear to the other side of the story before making up your mind. What gives everyone the right to do this is their free will and their faculty of reason. The Bible itself encourages us to examine it and prove it to ourselves ...'.

McRoberts also has a book called God: Can the God of the Bible Exist?

35

Jehovah Witnesses lost in Court. Disfellowshipped Sister Reinstated by Court Order?

by pistolpete in

imagine the "faithful" jws who are now having to talk to this person by court order or face the consequences----legally.. exjws are spreading the news and now some exjws who have been disfellowshipped for years are starting to research to see if this is an option in their country.

here are the articles, you need to translate in google.

https://www.nrk.no/norge/gry-nygard-ble-ekskludert-fra-jehovas-vitner-_-vant-i-lagmannsretten-1.15570621.

Disillusioned JW

My previous post post was made while I thought the disfellowshipped JW had won the Supreme Court ruling of Norway, but now I am not certain she won. Parts of the ruling as translated into English are very hard for me to comprehend (especially with its use of legal jargon). One post said the congregation won but another post gave me the impression the woman won. Who really won?

35

Jehovah Witnesses lost in Court. Disfellowshipped Sister Reinstated by Court Order?

by pistolpete in

imagine the "faithful" jws who are now having to talk to this person by court order or face the consequences----legally.. exjws are spreading the news and now some exjws who have been disfellowshipped for years are starting to research to see if this is an option in their country.

here are the articles, you need to translate in google.

https://www.nrk.no/norge/gry-nygard-ble-ekskludert-fra-jehovas-vitner-_-vant-i-lagmannsretten-1.15570621.

Disillusioned JW

I think there will be JW's who won't shun her. I think there are JWs who disapprove of the WT's shunning policy (including ones who want to quit the religion) and who will use the court ruling as a protective cover for them to avoid shunning the woman. The court's ruling could be the end of the WT's shunning policy in Norway and of JWs believing they will be disfellowshipped (or labeled as disassociated) if they associate with people who officially left the religion, though it probably won't end marking.

4

What do you know about Tartarus?

by raymond frantz in

sometimes a word can change everything and this is the case here with a word that appears only once in the bible but reveals so much about the powers of darkness, the influence of greek literature on the first apostles and finally and more relative to 1the intellectual dishonesty of the watchtower when it comes to presenting information from extra biblical sources.so if you like stories about the fallen angels and hollow earth stay presented from an exjw perspective watch this video.

https://youtu.be/zuv6zsuntci.

Disillusioned JW

It's all Greek mythology to me. Due to me watching a movie about the Titans (and later reading about Greek mythology about the Titans), when I think of Tartarus I think of the mythology which says the Titans were cast down and imprisoned. As a result when I now read (or even just think about) 2 Peter 2:4 I see it as another piece of evidence that much of the Bible is mythology (God tales that are false) and other false ideas.

18

Billions to die at Armageddon?

by BoogerMan in

not according to this verse:.

(mark 3:28, 29) truly i say to you that all things will be forgiven the sons of men, no matter what sins they commit and what blasphemies they speak.

but whoever blasphemes against the holy spirit has no forgiveness forever but is guilty of everlasting sin.”.

Disillusioned JW

During the time I was a JW (as well as when I was unbaptized but at least 8 years old or so and thus able to understand the WT literature regarding Armageddon) it was clear to me that the WT was teaching that the only human survivors of Armageddon would be JWs along with possibly some people (a small number compared to the number of baptized JWs) who had accepted most of the JW teachings.

14

Is it difficult to believe in a loving God?

by Kosonen in

jw
friends

is it difficult to believe in a loving god?.

if yes, i understand you.

it has been difficult to me too.

Disillusioned JW

Not only is it difficult to believe there is a supernatural god who acts lovingly to humankind, but it also difficult to believe there is a supernatural god who intervenes in human history, who communicates with any human, who wrote (or inspired or merely guided) the writing of the Bible, or who even listens to anyone's prayers. That is because there no convincing evidence for such a being of any of those kinds.

11

Jehovah’s witnesses and compulsory voting in Australia.

by Longlivetherenegades in

what do jehovah’s witnesses do during election period in australia?

i learnt voting is compulsory in australia and those who choose not to vote are fined.

do jehovah’s witnesses pay such fines?.

Disillusioned JW

For me voting has largely become a burden and tiresome. It is not the fun I thought it would be when I became a registered voter about 14 years ago. For example, my voters' pamphlet for the upcoming primary lists 9 Democratic party candidates for state Governor and 14 Republican Party Candidates for state Governor! Granted, for the governor's race I can only vote for my party's candidates in the upcoming primary, but I am someone who when voting takes voting seriously and thus carefully evaluates all of the candidates and ballot measures which I am entitled to vote on. That is a huge burden for me.

For the governor's race only one of the candidates is someone I already know and I believe that candidate will win the party primary (unless he/she makes a major mistake), but I don't want to automatically vote for that candidate. I believe that if I vote for governor I should seriously consider all of the other candidates of the party I am a member of, but doing such seriously is a lot of work.

I am thinking of not casting a vote in the partisan races and only voting in the nonpartisan races and on the ballot measures.

48

What is the harm or downside of being PIMO?

by PimoElder in

what is the harm or downside of being pimo?.

i get all the good things about being in the cong, good social life lots of invites to bbqs and meals out.

lots of interesting gossip 🤣🤣🤣🤣.

Disillusioned JW

nicolaou, at https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5767564746555392/my-story the person using the handle of PimoElder claims to really be a PIMO elder.

16

Disassociation letter

by joao in

i sent my disassociation letter two days ago!

i couldn't stand it anymore!

so many lies, the exploitation of sincere people, the ridiculous amount of rules and all this protection of pedophiles, plus the life of gb as if they were wealthy dictators!

Disillusioned JW

How are your wife and daughter reacting (if at all) to your official disassociation from the WT/JW religion?